U.S. Exceptionalism in Being a Police/Prison State
Re: U.S. Exceptionalism in Being a Police/Prison State
by Philly » Wed Jul 23, 2014 4:54 pm
go ahead. keep screaming "Shut The f**k Up " at me. it only makes my opinions Worse
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Re: U.S. Exceptionalism in Being a Police/Prison State
by Philly » Wed Jul 23, 2014 6:14 pm
Yeah, regardless of if it is technically 1st degree or not there's no way the cop is facing that charge. I think it will be manslaughter.
go ahead. keep screaming "Shut The f**k Up " at me. it only makes my opinions Worse
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Re: U.S. Exceptionalism in Being a Police/Prison State
by Dylan » Wed Jul 23, 2014 6:16 pm
He will probably walk and get a job at another PD.
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Re: U.S. Exceptionalism in Being a Police/Prison State
by Philly » Wed Jul 23, 2014 6:19 pm
go ahead. keep screaming "Shut The f**k Up " at me. it only makes my opinions Worse
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Re: U.S. Exceptionalism in Being a Police/Prison State
by Professor » Thu Jul 24, 2014 7:47 am
Well, I think that a lot of it will depend upon the coroner. Was his windpipe crushed? Or, did the chokehold set off his asthma?
The actual chokehold was applied for about 20 seconds. It was after the hold was released that the guy said he couldn't breathe. Something I learned during emergency response training was that, if someone is choking (like, on food) and they say, "I'm choking", then they simply have something lodged in their throat, but can still breathe, and therefore you shouldn't use the heimlich maneuver. But, if they cannot speak, then their airway is blocked and you need to use it. He could still breathe, at least enough to talk. This indicates that the hold did not "immediately" kill him.
Here's where I'm going with this. If the chokehold crushed his windpipe, then he might still be able to breathe a bit. But, perhaps not enough to sustain life. So, if the hold crushed his windpipe, then the cop killed him and it should probably be manslaughter, as a crushed windpipe should be seen as a foreseeable outcome. In other words, the cop was responsible.
However, if the hold simply triggered his asthma, then it'll likely be viewed as an accident. Much like when someone with a heart condition is tazed, and it triggers a heart attack. A taze should not be expected to trigger a heart attack in most people. Therefore, that outcome is unforeseeable.
But, a caveat to that last, which DOESN'T let the cop off the hook is that the hold is against policy. So, he should probably still be held accountable.
If I were the DA, and we find a crushed windpipe, I think I'd charge with 2nd degree murder. It clearly wasn't premeditated. But, I could defend a "heat of the moment" charge. If it was asthma triggered by the hold, then I think manslaughter.
The actual chokehold was applied for about 20 seconds. It was after the hold was released that the guy said he couldn't breathe. Something I learned during emergency response training was that, if someone is choking (like, on food) and they say, "I'm choking", then they simply have something lodged in their throat, but can still breathe, and therefore you shouldn't use the heimlich maneuver. But, if they cannot speak, then their airway is blocked and you need to use it. He could still breathe, at least enough to talk. This indicates that the hold did not "immediately" kill him.
Here's where I'm going with this. If the chokehold crushed his windpipe, then he might still be able to breathe a bit. But, perhaps not enough to sustain life. So, if the hold crushed his windpipe, then the cop killed him and it should probably be manslaughter, as a crushed windpipe should be seen as a foreseeable outcome. In other words, the cop was responsible.
However, if the hold simply triggered his asthma, then it'll likely be viewed as an accident. Much like when someone with a heart condition is tazed, and it triggers a heart attack. A taze should not be expected to trigger a heart attack in most people. Therefore, that outcome is unforeseeable.
But, a caveat to that last, which DOESN'T let the cop off the hook is that the hold is against policy. So, he should probably still be held accountable.
If I were the DA, and we find a crushed windpipe, I think I'd charge with 2nd degree murder. It clearly wasn't premeditated. But, I could defend a "heat of the moment" charge. If it was asthma triggered by the hold, then I think manslaughter.
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