This Evening on the trump Fake News Hour

[Saz]

[exploited]

I'm not sure the historical record supports your contentions, Saz.

Obama tried on a number of occasions to close down GB. Congressional Republicans opposed him, and made it virtually impossible for him to address the issue in a sensible way. He issued an Executive Order to close GB within a year and then presented a plan to Congress, with some going back to Middle Eastern countries, and some to be moved to the mainland US. This was shutdown and opposed, like everything else he tried to do in office. You could argue that he pursued this knowing it would fail - which is reasonable - but that doesn't necessarily mean he didn't genuinely support the measure.

Supporting GB is a declaration of moral and political depravity. I'm usually more interested in pragmatism than principles, but in this case, the precedent created and the realities of the prison make it impossible for any rational person to support its continued operation. I'm not surprised to see you support it, because you are genuinely amoral, but for a large chunk of the American population, it is a terrible affront to American values, and a massive stain on its reputation. That stain is only going to grow under a President who openly supports torture and illegality.

[Spider]

[Saz]

Yes he is. You will lie tomorrow, I will lie tomorrow, everyone will lie tomorrow. You act like it's the worst thing in the world when you can't find a single president who hasn't lied to the public on a daily basis. It's not a crime. If anything it's worse to take something so literal it distorts the actual truth of the matter. Like saying the Bush admin released all the gitmo detainees when the admin was FORCED legally and politically, to do so by the left...who now wants to blame those releases on the Administration. Again, you can whine about this as long as you want but it only makes Trump supporters correct in assuming those who oppose him are partisan hypocrites and idiots who all of a sudden make a big deal about the president lying when Obama and every president before him regularly lied and no one said a thing.

[exploited]

I think what needs to be realized here is that lying is absolutely required to hold that position. If the President didn't lie on a regular basis, he would be exposing intelligence officers, soldiers and even civilians to danger.

The reason why it is important to recognize this is because it gives you a good position from which to analyze the current system. If you find lying to be undesirable and wrong, then you need to take a long and hard look at the national security state, and what that entails. From there you can start asking questions about the role America should play in the world... if it insists on policing it, and competing with other powers on the basis of influence (hard and soft), lying is integral to the whole thing.

In essence, show me a modern President who doesn't consistently and regularly lie, and I'll show you an incompetent idiot.

[Spider]

[Saz]

[NAB]

[Saz]

[NAB]